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Wake Island Scenario?
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Do you think a Wake Island scenario would be worth adding?
Absolutely! It would be worth a fee to get it!
30%
 30%  [ 3 ]
Meh. I’d only play it if it were free.
10%
 10%  [ 1 ]
I’d be primarily interested in single player.
40%
 40%  [ 4 ]
I’d be primarily interested in multi-player.
20%
 20%  [ 2 ]
Total Votes : 10

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Sightreader


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Dec - 02:40 (2017)    Post subject: Wake Island Scenario? Reply with quote

Hey everyone!


I don’t know if this has been discussed before, but there was a missed opportunity for a fascinating carrier battle featuring the Saratoga taking advantage of decrypted intelligence to engage the Japanese Wake Island landing supported by the Soryu and Hiryu - a mere two weeks after Pearl Harbor!


After inadequate Japanese forces were repulsed trying to land on Wake Island, the Soryu and Hiryu were detoured from the returning Pearl Harbor strike force to reduce the Marine air base and support a second invasion attempt. Decrypted intelligence alerted Admiral Kimmel to this move and he energetically took the opportunity to have the Saratoga attack the Japanese landing force and restore his name, but he was fired over Pearl Harbor before he could see it through. Admiral Pye, acting commander until Nimitz took over, didn’t want to risk a major engagement during his short tenure and ordered the relief effort to withdraw, abandoning the Marines on Wake Island to their hopeless (and horrible) fate.


I think this would be a nice, neat scenario with manageably small forces on a simple map. Although small, there’s an interesting balance of forces with several options, mixing carrier and cruiser units as well as land based air support from the Japanese Marshalls and the Marines on Wake. There are also interesting what-if variations regarding the role of US carriers - the Lexington was sent on a diversionary mission and the Enterprise could have been made available  - as well as other variations in force balance depending on the aftermath of the first invasion attempt.


I didn’t know whether to send this suggestion through email or the forum, so I used both. I hope that didn’t cause annoyance to anyone.


Thanks for listening and your thoughts!


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larsenjp
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PostPosted: Sun 10 Dec - 15:46 (2017)    Post subject: Wake Island Scenario? Reply with quote

Yes, i think this should be a very nice scenario.

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Sightreader


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PostPosted: Sun 10 Dec - 16:38 (2017)    Post subject: Wake Island Scenario? Reply with quote

larsenjp wrote:
Yes, i think this should be a very nice scenario.






Thanks! I saw this possibility in passing while reading Layton’s book. I gather a lot of conjecture is required to reconstruct what Kimmel might have had in mind: if his dismissal had arrived a week later, things would have been very different. 


Scenario possibilities start with Lexington intending nothing more than a solo raid on the Marshalls, escalate to the Lexington raid being a mere diversion while Saratoga sneaks in to reinforce Wake and attack transports, to a full fledged carrier battle designed to destroy the Soryu and Hiryu themselves with the combined might of Enterprise, Saratoga, and Lexington. Not knowing whether the American target is a dash to Wake, a raid on the Marshalls, or their actual carriers would create a lot of uncertainty for the Japanese.


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larsenjp
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PostPosted: Tue 12 Dec - 19:29 (2017)    Post subject: Wake Island Scenario? Reply with quote

Yes, very interesting, a lot of possibilities indeed.

I am convinced it would really be a nice scenario with minimum effort regarding the map.

BR, you should have a look, you are always interested in adding scenarios to new versions of the game.


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Sightreader


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PostPosted: Tue 12 Dec - 20:20 (2017)    Post subject: Wake Island Scenario? Reply with quote

larsenjp wrote:
Yes, very interesting, a lot of possibilities indeed.


Yay, thanks for the support!  I’ve always been fascinated by this scenario, as I know the Marines never forgave Admiral Pye for abandoning them at Wake. 

I suppose Japanese variants are possible as well, as the number of carriers detached from Kido Butai would be proportional to Japanese estimates of the surviving strength of the Wake Island garrison.  It boggles the mind to think what effects a carrier engagement at Wake would have had on the subsequent string of devastating carrier strikes against the British, even if the result were to be nothing more than an extended delay of Soryu and Hiryu.


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larsenjp
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PostPosted: Tue 12 Dec - 20:34 (2017)    Post subject: Wake Island Scenario? Reply with quote

Yes fascinating perspectives.

Maybe we may have a taste of it when the game will be added a campaign mode.


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Bladerunner
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PostPosted: Fri 29 Dec - 00:50 (2017)    Post subject: Wake Island Scenario? Reply with quote

Very interesting idea to merge Wake and the Marshall Islands in the same scenario
As for the Revenge Raids scénario, the Japanese forces are weak and one should find rules to balancing it somehow


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Sightreader


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PostPosted: Fri 29 Dec - 01:05 (2017)    Post subject: Wake Island Scenario? Reply with quote

Bladerunner wrote:
Very interesting idea to merge Wake and the Marshall Islands in the same scenario






Hmm... interesting... were all the Marshall Island raids during the Wake Island campaign?


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USS Archerfish
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PostPosted: Sun 31 Dec - 07:12 (2017)    Post subject: Wake Island Scenario? Reply with quote

Sightreader


It’s a very interesting idea and I would love to play it.  The best way to move this forward is to help do the leg work by doing research and posting it here.


In addition to the CVs, we need to know how many aircraft of each type each CV has.  Since the event never happened it may be difficult to get an exact number but we can use the CB community help to get it as close as possible.  We would also need to know how many escort ships each CV has.  If you’re lucky there might be some old board game or miniature scenarios on line some where that already has this info 


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Sightreader


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PostPosted: Sun 31 Dec - 07:23 (2017)    Post subject: Wake Island Scenario? Reply with quote

USS Archerfish wrote:
It’s a very interesting idea and I would love to play it.  The best way to move this forward is to help do the leg work by doing research and posting it here.


I can give it a try, but I’m no expert. My impression was that everything’s on hold anyways since the search system is being reworked?


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USS Archerfish
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PostPosted: Sun 31 Dec - 09:08 (2017)    Post subject: Wake Island Scenario? Reply with quote

Doesn’t matter.  I wrote the scenario for the Raid On Marshall Island. I know it will be used eventully. 

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USS Archerfish
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PostPosted: Sun 31 Dec - 09:22 (2017)    Post subject: Wake Island Scenario? Reply with quote

Sightreader


I just posted what I wrote for the Raid On Marshall Island scenario here in the New Feature section for you to view. Several members in this forum helped me fill in some of the blanks. Hopefully this will give you ideas on how to go about it.  If you have any questions feel free to ask. 


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Sightreader


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PostPosted: Sun 31 Dec - 16:29 (2017)    Post subject: Wake Island Scenario? Reply with quote

Thanks, great info and tremendous research! 


Sounds like the Marshall Raid, which you have down as Feb 1st, would be a month or so after Wake, which is more like Dec 23; I’m guessing the forces would be a bit different.


As a teacher, I naturally got quite a bit of work to get ready for another semester of craziness, but maybe I’ll get lucky and have a chance to check out that book on Black Shoe Fletcher...


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USS Archerfish
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PostPosted: Sun 31 Dec - 18:26 (2017)    Post subject: Wake Island Scenario? Reply with quote

Sightreader wrote:
Thanks, great info and tremendous research! 


Sounds like the Marshall Raid, which you have down as Feb 1st, would be a month or so after Wake, which is more like Dec 23; I’m guessing the forces would be a bit different.


As a teacher, I naturally got quite a bit of work to get ready for another semester of craziness, but maybe I’ll get lucky and have a chance to check out that book on Black Shoe Fletcher...



I read some reviews on that and there were some complaints about it. It’s relatively new 2006. One guy in particular wrote a lengthy paper on the fault of the guys research. I felt some of it was convincing so I deleted the recommendation until I did some more research. 


Here is the link to the blog that essentially accuses the writer of Black Shoe Carrier Admiral or rewriting history so to speak. 
http://divebombervsblackshoeadmiral.blogspot.com/
The author of the Black Shoe Carrier Admiral also wrote The First Team: From Pearl Harbor to Midway.  I think this book may provide the data we are looking for carrier battles and new “What if” scenarios. 


Anyway, the blog makes for interesting read. 


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USS Archerfish
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PostPosted: Sun 31 Dec - 18:41 (2017)    Post subject: Wake Island Scenario? Reply with quote

Here is a good read on wake.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Wake_Island  


There is an interesting mention that the first Japanese surface ships sunk by the US was sunk by an F4F!!!  In light of this info BR may have to consider rewriting the rules on allowing fighters to attack ships. 


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